Have fun down there! Sorry to hear you sold at the bottom.

tl;dr - Ver/Wu falsely support opponents of Bitcoin with a "better" coin that is doomed to fail from the start, while pumping opponents money into Bitcoin, and giving Bitcoin a real world, live quality assurance test that proves Bitcoin's resiliency.

---------------

So, I've been thinking about this, and bear with me as this "thinking" was more a bar napkin idea one night out with friends haha. McAfee said that Wu was the smartest person he knows (paraphrasing?). I wondered why he would say that; is it based on anything real, or is it more McAfee being his ridiculous self? I tried to look at it from another perspective than what I see from either side of the debate on this forum and reddit.

What if Ver/Wu team are not scamming Bitcoin faithful, but more so the big blockers and other opponents to Bitcoin? There have been how many attempts to create and overtake Bitcoin with an alternative (BCH, BU, etc)? All but BCH are/have been forgotten; I certainly don't remember most of them. What if all along they are proving Bitcoin really is the ideal coin?:

- Opponents say Bitcoin needs *something. //whatever the flavor of the month is; currently big blocks
- Build up hype, agree with them.
- Spin off Bitcoin *something (BS) alt coin at some arbitrary price implementing these ideas.
- BTC faithful dump BS to supporters of BS, pumping money into BTC that wouldn't have been there initially (aka, round about forcing opponents to put their money into BTC), essentially creating what looks like free money/BTC to us.
- BTC proves it is better and outlasts BS, solidifying it's ability to withstand huge pressures from internal conflicts  (as if this is a live QA test; BTC has shown its resiliency to many outside forces already).
- Repeat with next idea opponents to core say BTC needs via new BS coin.
- ?
- Profit


OK, now tell me why I'm dumb haha.

http://bitcoinsavingsplan.com/

This?

This^

Hasn't the weekend dump been happening (for the most part) on a weekly basis for months, if not years? Who cares if it's goes into BCH, or ETH, or LTC, or (insert other coin here).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0sPvylTPCv8

_{(edit - grammar/typos)}

The only positive change over the last 24 hours on Coinmarketcap (top 100): Tether...

I think you mean the roughly 14,000 users:
"with at least the equivalent of $20,000 in any one transaction type (buy, sell, send, or receive) in any one year during the 2013-2015 period.
do[es] not include users: (a) who only bought and held bitcoin during the 2013-15 period; or (b) for which Coinbase filed Forms 1099-K during the 2013-15 period"


I believe this was posted earlier, but if not, here is a copy of the Narrowed Summons to Coinbase
https://www.scribd.com/document/365893210/US-v-Coinbase-order?irgwc=1&content=10079&campaign=Skimbit%2C%20Ltd.&ad_group=66960X1514734Xfb366f45a06c38b3049ba2d8889f39ea&keyword=ft750noi&source=impactradius&medium=affiliate#from_embed


_{Edit:URL and grammar}

I was thinking about this same situation. Wouldn't it be possible to move your coins to a new address*^ and pay taxes on it now (2017) as if you sold it all. Then physically move, and declare whatever you have (if you have to) with the new addresses and live happily ever after when the price moons.

*I'm assuming you would set this up via VPN, TOR, or whatever, so that it can't be tied back to you as being a resident of USA and thus taxed when you try to leave (idk, IANAL/Accountant)
^Also assuming moving from one wallet to another is a taxable event (i.e. the whole Coinbase -> private wallet issue). I'm sure there is more I'm not taking into account; beer isn't helping me think of those either, haha

https://bitcoinfees.earn.com/

Do you need me to explain this to think for you? Or can you figure it out on your own?

You are correct!


https://blockchain.info/address/3GyeFJmQynJWd8DeACm4cdEnZcckAtrfcN
https://blockchain.info/address/16xShq4S9xfB5wg9ygsjGdWCNdNn3M5TB7
https://blockchain.info/address/1KYJySPCTYFCToK4zPghtDtaZzRAHjtA2v

Take your time, I know it's difficult to understand, lots of numbers, letters and what not.

Not that I plan on leaving here anytime soon, any recommendations as to other forums/platforms worth following (not reddit)?

IDK about In-Q-Tel buying it all up, but I do know the various three letter agencies were mining BTC (and I would assume the various other CCs as well) in the beginning. To the effect of multiple wallets with thousands of coins each.

Haha, if I had them I would!

I wish I'd been there and involved with it, but I wasn't unfortunately. I guarantee I'd have way more coins than what I do now

More along the lines of someone drinking too much and talking about things they probably shouldn't have  

Why kind of systems exist that prevent "cheating"? From sports, to computers, to financial transactions, all systems are vulnerable to being used in a way that is not intended...

I don't follow your logic.

You continue to say bitcoin has no value due to being strictly digital, nothing tangible in the "real" world (unlike gold).

In that context, we should ignore everything you post, until your publish a book that I can hold in my hand and read; your posts are pixels on my screen, a digital representation of your thoughts, thus no value.

How do digital words have value, but digital money doesn't?

With all (most) of the alts in the red too, anyone else find it ironic that today is the start of the "crypto" winter?  


Also, welcome back Peter R (as well as all these names I've never seen before talking shit)! I thought it was a nice touch how you clip out a small bit of Greg's post and spun it. I also found it great how you ignored a direct question earlier that would have caught you contradicting yourself, and instead you changed topic. Excellent, I'm sure you are a god at getting everyone all riled up on reddit  

Still, my favorite is how you emphasize your "volunteer" work, and then proceed to itemize a list of accomplishments with some lofty dollar value attached that also just so happened to increase your stash (of course you weren't paid; I'm sure you gifted those coins for your wonderful voluntary contributions   ).

If I'm not too young (post count wise), I'll take 22/01/2018

In what way? Looks exactly like December 26th-28th, almost exactly where it is today except a bit higher. So, breaking bubbling upwards... again?

_{edit: further thoughts/ramblings, and grammar}

Elaborate. There are multiple phases of a bubble, which do you see/think we are in? First sell off? Return to the mean? Both of those are right before great increases => bullish.

Haha, thank you for that. Too many times people make blanket statements on here without any explanation of their thought process or the logic behind it. Or even worse, a screenshot of a trading view with nothing else accompanying it. Those times I wonder what's the point, to prove they can take a screenshot?

There are a lot of smart people on this thread, it's the reason I've followed it for years; even before being able to afford my first bit of btc. For someone who isn't a trader by trade (ha), it's nice to have insight into why others on here think the price will move one way or another (even if they are wrong sometimes  )

Bear with me while I read you a scripture  

_{edit: awww, too young for pictures still? lol}

Apparently not what? That the mempool isn't clearing? That lightning isn't active?

I'm assuming you're over 13 if you're using the internet alone; use your big words and sentences, or ask the adult with you for help. It's not that hard.

I'm mad that I/others have to read your drivel and that it's taking up space forever on this wall.

I am quite happy with BTC's performance over the last few years, and have no doubt I will be even more so in time to come.

That's what I assumed as well. My point was that they should say that and stop making people assume. At the time the price was changing +-$100; negligible compared to what we've been dealing with the last few days and weeks. Even now, the price is still within ~$100 of this morning; apparently the news/non-news is not having all that great an effect on price as they implied.

It's just annoying seeing "click-bait-esque" posts on here that the user adds nothing to the conversations. I'd much rather read through longer posts (like yours or even, dare I say it, r0ach's haha), at least I can try and glean something from them.

If I wanted useless posts, I'd go to r/btc. Oh well, my ignore list grows (like it matters, I'm a nobody here :p).

_{Edit: The next 24 hours are critical}

You would if you were the man

I hear you, my man. My friends/family/coworkers were all the same way. I told them to get in when it was $250ish (2013), that it was potentially world changing, and I was laughed out the room. I still remind my old roommate about his response, "Yeahhhh, no thanks. I've got some gold coins, I think I'm good." Or my boss, when it dropped like a stone, "Ha! How's your bitcoin treating you now?" - He no longer speaks to me haha.

Back then, I was part of that $500 emergency group, as shameful as it is to say. I couldn't afford it; I was so far in debt from making some stupid mistakes when I was younger (well, more from stupid lawyer fees, but I digress lol ) that my credit cards/loans took everything (we're talking 10's of thousands). Still, I found a way to put $25-50 a paycheck into btc; skipped trips, partying, dating, etc.

Selling as it rose over the last 6 months, I can say I'm now debt free. Paid all my cards off, paid my student loans off, and I was able to put a small down payment and own my own place. I wish I'd kept all the messages from those same people over the course of December, "fuck you and your bitcoin". Sorry I'm not sorry, but it's never to late to join the party

As always, HODL; even better things are soon to come. Just don't think that's the end all/be all, spend some if it will make your life better. Just make sure not to sell it all

The price also surged over 30% in the 7 days leading up to Dec 6th (~8500 -> 11500). Should we assume they had insider knowledge they were getting subpoenaed before hand and started the pump prematurely?

Which of those payment methods are you in control of all your own money?
Gpay, VISA, Venmo: all built on top of the banking infrastructure, who hold your money and issue you IOUs. Replace banks with bitcoin, which is in your control.

I don't get it, the guy posts a bullish news article at a time when there is very little good news surrounding bitcoin (mostly just FUD) and you shit all over him? Who gives a shit if it's on that website? I doubt roger himself wrote the article (hint: he didn't). What's the guy shilling, Korean news? Lol.

How many governments have officially come out and said that bitcoin is recognized as having actual, real world value - not banning crypto currencies, or saying crypto is only used by criminals, etc. - especially in one of the biggest crypto markets in the world?

Did you guys lackadaisically brush off when Japan made BTC a legal currency? Or when Overstock.com said they were going to accept BTC, were you guys like, "whoopdi fuckin' doo, we all know it's got value, congrats company for figuring out what we already know"? No, we were all happy it was being adopted by a well known company where we could buy real things with our bitcoin.

Bitcoin being accepted as legal currency in Japan and South Korea aren't... legal? Or do you mean, you can't pay most lawyers with btc? Actually, I'm sure you could probably pay off a judge/politician easier with bitcoin than cash haha.




What are the technical developments of XRP, ETH, and EOS that surpass Bitcoin? It would be nice to know now, rather than a year from now.

I believe it is mocking the original poster of the chart, implying that the lines they drew mean as much as a bat/batman pasted on top.

I thought you guys already lost all your pants 

I find it very difficult to believe the moon landings were faked.

Considering the political environment of the time, the USA was in a race against a technically competent opponent full of very smart people, don't you think Russia, China, or any other country capable of doing so, would have called out the USA immediately? Embarrass the shit out of the USA by proving mathematically/showing that they did not in fact do what they said? I've never read or heard of such.

Edit: Regarding the photos, those I have no comment on. They could have been faked, sure; the actual landings though, I don't believe so.

I believe something like this already exists. Started in 2007 in Estonia, called Keyless security infrastructure. There are companies now trying to use in other markets as well
https://e-estonia.com/solutions/security-and-safety/ksi-blockchain/

“I respect Bitmain, but we will bypass them," said CEO of GMO Masatoshi Kumagai.

Recall that in September 2017 GMO Internet Group announced plans to invest $ 320 million in the mining industry and the creation of a new generation of chips. According to representatives of the Japanese Internet giant, bitcoin is intended to become a “universal currency”, providing “unlimited economic freedom”.

I love their confidence and outlook on bitcoin.

Interesting. Log scale shows an almost inverse correlation between hash rate and price.  I wonder if this holds true for more than just the past year (didn't realize graph was all time  ). Did price dip with that big increase in hashpower recently?

Of course correlation =/= causation.

I find it absolutely hilarious how hypocritical the people in this thread are. The constant rhetoric in this thread is that shills/scammers resort to name calling, misdirection, and censoring attempts at silencing people who disagree with them.

anonymint came in here and provided an intellectually stimulating conversation for once; backed by a logical progression of his thoughts and where he derived them from (whether he is right or wrong is irrelevant). How many posters here actually do that? Maybe 10? Hell, even roach falls in this category!

What was the response to his posts?
- A few individuals read what he wrote, and had a decent discussion about it with a few even offering a well written rebuttal (they are part of the 10 posters mentioned before).

- Called a "fucking retard" or some variation with zero reference to what he said, let alone trying to refute it.
- Labeled him a bcash shill, which is laughable as he says it is shit in pretty much everything he writes
- You have banana man taking out his dick and trying to show people how big it is, talking about how much bitcoin he's bought and sold which has no relevance to the conversation at hand.
- Then there are calls for his removal and for him to delete his posts because it's off topic... as if 90% of the garbage posts on here aren't off topic.

Name calling. Misdirection. Censoring.

If anything, the absurd reaction to his posts leads me to believe he's more correct than not, and I have only just started reading it. This thread has fallen apart, because the few people that are interesting to read and who are actually contributing worthwhile information are slowly being driven away one by one.

I think the reason you don't like anonymint is because not only are his posts longer than yours, they actually contain relevant information throughout.

Edit - Soooo, are you saying you are a troll? Lol.

hmm, maybe he is correct and your reading comprehension skills aren't up to par to understand, let alone debate him.

Don't really care about what sites he links. Assume no site is secure; you best protect ya neck and you'll be just fine 

Can you at least put some effort in? It's not even entertaining anymore.



https://imgur.com/a/y50glpY

I drew lines, they look like they are going up. I'm a professional trader now according to this board

Not sure why everyone freaks out when it drops from $7k -> $6k. Unless you bought BTC in the last year and that is all you know, this is really, really boring movement.

If you need better off-road capabilities in luxury, you can step it up to this



Top Gear Review - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrUVMdkb4_k

https://www.mercedes-benz.com/en/mercedes-benz/innovation/the-automotive-declaration-of-independence/

Even if cryptocaps are backed by the appropriate amount of physical hats, it's abundantly obvious they have no schelling point and thus we're setting ourselves up for hatastrophe 

Lulz @ "We use a term incorrectly, thus you using it correctly is incorrect."

edit- grammar

To follow up on that, this only talks about the richest people that report their wealth. I have friends working with people who essentially own various industries (i.e. oil) who are worth so much more than Bezos (in the order of 2-3x, maybe more) that it is staggering to think about, but you will never see it printed anywhere. Makes you think...

(about what, IDK, but it makes you think haha)

Interesting watch on nuclear power if you're afraid of it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciStnd9Y2ak

I feel like a lot of you have a love-hate relationship with roach. I would love to see the stats on roach's posts compared to the amount of posts about roach. It's probably a 1:5, maybe even 1:10 ratio. He posts what, maybe a few times a day? Followed by 30 posts of people complaining about him in one way or another.

"roach , you didn't even answer the question..."
"roach is wrong in his fundamentals..."
"roach should be banned..."
"just ignore roach, he'll go away..."


He's made his points clear, we all know what he is, and what he thinks. So... stfu. You know what I can't stand? Olives. You know what I don't talk about (barring this example)? Olives. If someone else posts about them, I just scroll on past and ignore it. Guess what I never have to worry about on here? That's right, having to think about those gross, little, round things.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTurSi0LhJs

When you're on WO, and roach says something ridiculous, stfu.
When roach says "Something, something, jew, something, metals, something", stfu.
If you stfu and ignore him, you'll never have to worry about roach.

I honestly don't care about his posts, if anything it makes me think about why I disagree with him, further cementing my own beliefs. 

I never said I was against it or him; I'm calling out the irony/hypocrisy of everyone complaining about him, all while perpetuating his existence. If anything, find it humorous and entertaining, just like your misinterpretation of my post.

You are like the people who claim to hate Trump, and then go on to complain about him for 2 hours. If you really disliked someone that much, you wouldn't let them effect you so. By the end of the diatribe, I'm not sure if they do hate him or would rather suck his dick.


_{edit: spelling}

You made the error due to not understanding the distinct difference between disagreeing with someone and calling for the censorship of said person. Let me know when you do, and we can continue this conversation.

Haha, I'm sorry you keep losing the argument and have to continually change the focus of this conversation. It's like arguing with my girlfriend when she knows she is wrong, eye rolls included.

Who gives a shit about flags and tags (why even bring them up?)? People are literally asking for roach to be banned and/or his posts deleted because they disagree with him and find him annoying. If that's not censoring, tell me your definition of it so we're on the same page.

I'm not sure if you're trolling, or (sadly) just can't see it.

Once again you change the subject  

Not ironic; I don't care about him or what he says (you should try it); if anything, I use my brain and reaffirm my arguments against him. Don't be such a pansy. You mocked me, patronized me, all because I called out the ridiculousness of people complaining about someone they can completely ignore. You can ignore me, just like I'm putting you on ignore. Yes, I am an asshole, and so are you (probably most of us here, whether we admit it or not), and the fact that you are legendary shows just how far this thread has fallen over the last 7 or so years I've been a part of it.

Now I remember why I stopped coming here; if you're not part of the echo chamber, you're told to gtfo and your opinions are invalid (to get off of roach, jbreher has been subject to this multiple times)... it's pathetic.

I snagged your spot in the game. If for some reason that range actually hits, I have no problem splitting it with you.